I think the biggest challenge for me is finding my right place in the bands that I have played in, this being the third. The first was the trio which included Stu Hamm and myself. That band was all about over playing and chance taking. Being a trio, we all had a lot of space to fill up. I was triggering all sorts of guitar and keyboard parts with a couple of Octapads and Akai S1000's, while Stu was covering other parts with the two-handed tapping that he's known for. The caliber of musicianship made it very easy to take chances and play off each other in any and every direction. The second incarnation, which was my favorite, included Phil Ashley on keyboards. The reason it was my favorite, was because of Phil's ability as a player - he covered all of the fourth person parts that Stu and I had to previously cover, which in turn freed us both up, allowing us to concentrate more on just playing our own instrument and solidifying our parts. The best performances the band ever played were on that tour. The third and newest formation includes Jeff Campitelli on rhythm guitar. He's a friend of Joe's who is primarily a drum programmer, but recently learned how to play guitar so he could join us on the road. That's where the challenge comes in. Since Jeff can't quite cover what Phil was doing before, Stu and I are finding ourselves playing in a four-piece band, but still having to cover quite a bit like we're in the trio as well. Finding that middle ground is what it's all about.

    You seem to be the drummer of choice for elite guitar players. Talk about playing with Steve Hackett and Steve Howe.

    I guess that's true. I don't really look at it that way. On paper it certainly comes across like that. Playing with Hackett and Howe at twenty one was a really great experience. Joining GTR was my first real step into the industry as a professional, although I had already played with Marillion and a few others. But that was nothing compared to playing in a "supergroup." They were great to work with, but the only real problem was that they came from entirely different backgrounds with their previous bands. They could never agree on how to get things done, Howe and Yes had one way of doing things and Hackett and Genesis had another. Eventually it just broke down and nothing was getting done, so I split. I learned a lot on that gig; from the process of writing music, to the dollars and cents of the business, not all of which seemed so positive at the time, but certainly is now. Playing with Frank Gambale was a lot of fun as well. He's an absolutely incredible technician, and his music, coming from the jazz side, gave me an outlet that most of my other gigs didn't do. But I must say that the greatest experience for me with a guitar player was with Blondie Chaplin, in a band called Skollie. I toured extensively with them for three months, in the summer of '89, all over the former Soviet Union. It was a South African tribal influenced pop/funk/reggae band that took me musically, lyrically, rhythmically, culturally and spiritually further than any other gig to this day. He and that band pulled things out of me that I still can't seem to do by myself.

    With the music business so driven by profit, and quality being measured by CD sales, how do you manage to remain true to the art of drumming?

    Remaining true to the art of drumming is the easy part, I just absolutely love to play the drums. The hard part is dealing with everything and everyone else on the business level, then surviving it financially and emotionally. If it were just a question of sitting down and playing, this job would be way too easy.

    Tell me about your own band, Einstein.

    Einstein is my own group that I've been working on for a few years now. It's a trio that features Stan Jankowski on guitars and lead vocal, Jani Mangini on keyboards and backing vocals and myself on drums and backing vocals. The music is what I call aggressive progressive rock. There's quite a bit of odd time signatures and polyrhythms, but with very melodic vocal lines. So, although you can't count to four that often, it's still very listenable and easy to follow. We shopped our tape around about a year ago and got some great feedback and interest, unfortunately though, it would have meant starting over from scratch and entailed our working with a producer who we didn't feel really understood what we were all about. We also feared he would turn us into something that we didn't want to be, so we decided to go ahead and do it all ourselves. The record will be out this summer and we plan to start touring as soon as I'm off the road with Joe.

    How much were you involved with the composition of this project?

    I produced and mixed the record. As for the compositions, I would say that about 90% of the music is mine and about 90% of the lyrics are Stan's. We fill in each others spaces when needed, then throw it all at Jani and make her play it. Having a polymetric keyboardist in the band is great because she plays bass and keyboards simultaneously, then solos without hesitation, and does it all in odd time. I'm really lucky to have both of them to work with.

    I love the name of the record label that Einstein is on: Radio Free Records. It suggests to me that it's adventurous music. Music that won't be held hostage to "pop" radio. Is this true?

    Radio Free Records is out own label, and though it doesn't mean that we'll never be played across the airwaves, it does mean that we won't sell out or conform.

    How much formal training do you have and how important is it for a drummer to have formal training in order to compete in the music business these days?

    I was primarily self taught, but did study with Gary Chaffee for a short time right after high school before moving to London. I think it depends on what you're looking to do in the industry. Obviously, you don't need a lot of formal training to play in most of the alternative bands out there today, but that's what's so cool about them; they're very natural and creative, which can sometimes be lost with formal training. On the other hand, don't expect to play with Chick Corea or sight read a Pepsi commercial without any. Everybody and every situation is different, and there's always the exception to the rule, like Dennis Chambers! I wouldn't really call myself a formally trained drummer, but the little that I had with Chaffee certainly helped to prepare me for what I've encountered with people like Aretha Franklin, Frank Gambale and Joe Satriani.

    I think they need to compliment each other and work hand in hand. No pun intended. Too much of one or the other isn't very good, but don't confuse technique with chops. Though there are similarities at times, they can be two entirely different animals. Technique is not just what you play and how you execute it, it's also what you're playing in the song and how you're playing it with the others in the band.

    Which do you prefer, recording or performing?

    If we're talking about strictly playing drums then I'd have to say performing. That spur of the moment creativity and the reaction from the audience is usually more rewarding than listening to a track on some CD that I just recorded. But the situation with Einstein is different, there I'd say it's more of an equal pleasure. The difference is, in the studio with them, it's my music that I'm producing and creating with my band, and being there from the start right through to the finish is a lot more rewarding than laying down a few drum tracks, going home and thinking about my next session.

   What style of music, or what artist(s) do you listen to in your leisure that would surprise the average Jonathan Mover fan?

    Classical and African. Especially from the Soweto Townships.

   Do you do clinics? If so, how often, and is there a schedule of future Jonathan Mover clinics already in the process of being organized?

    I love doing clinics when I have the time, and yes, there will be more in the future.

    Do you still take lessons?

    I haven't since I was with Chaffee about 15 years ago, but I did hang out with him quite a bit at this past NAMM show, and we talked about getting together sometime soon. I also have wanted to study with Ed Soph for quite some time now and hope to hook up with him while I'm out on the next leg with Joe.

    If you could take an hour lesson from any drummer living or dead, who would it be?

    John Bonham without a doubt, but an hour would definitely not be enough.

    What are your thoughts on drum soloing?

     I love drum solos, but for me there's got to be a reason. My reason for soloing is to demonstrate to a particular audience, aspects of my playing that I want to show or think they want to hear. Soloing with Joe and Frank and Alice Cooper were ideal for just that, but Aretha and Skollie weren't. So as much as I love doing them, I'm fine without them as well. That's why I enjoy doing clinics so much, it's the right audience and atmosphere for a drum solo.

    Give me a scenario where you might fill the music as opposed to supporting it, and visa versa.

    I guess Joe would be a good example of the filling in approach. Like we were discussing earlier, being in a trio, and an instrumental one at that, there was a lot of space that needed to be filled, which was a part of that gig. Aretha, on the other hand, was quite the opposite. Just laying down a great back beat and following the charts were what made that gig work. Every gig's different, and hopefully, if you're lucky, you get a gig where you can do a bit of both.

    Have you ever gotten the urge to persuade a producer or an artist that you were working for to allow you to leave a comfort zone by pushing the boundaries of a particular drum part?

    Yes, but not that often. Usually, the producer has a pretty good idea of what he/she wants for that particular artist and song. But occasionally, I find myself in the position where a producer and/or artist might ask my opinion.

   Without trying to bruise an ego or sound like you're over stepping your job description as a session drummer, how would you approach the artist and/or producer about doing a drum part that you heard differently than originally intended?

    If I really believed in the part that I wanted to play, I would approach them exactly like that. If they were interested then in hearing what I had to say or play, then I would demonstrate. If they weren't interested, then I'd shut up and play what they requested of me. Both circumstances have happened. Right or wrong, it's not my session and the bottom line is - Who's writing the check!

    Have you or would you care to work with a jazz influenced trio or quartet using at least one horn player?

    Sure, I'd like to do it if it was the right situation. I loved the horns with Aretha, there's nothing like it. The ideal situation for me would've been something like the Jaco Patorious Big Band that Peter Erskine played in with Michael Brecker. I could deal with that.

   What are your thoughts on improvised music vs. composed music?

    The little bit of improvised music that I've heard hasn't really done much for me. Like I said, I haven't heard a lot so there may be some great pieces out there that I'm not aware of, but what I have heard just sounds like a bunch of musicians playing on their own, all at the same time. That doesn't make very much sense to me. The way Frank Zappa conducted his pieces and a group like Polytown are easier for me to relate to.

   Does classical music influence you at all? If so, what particular composers do you admire?

    I can't really say that it directly influences me in a compositional sense, but indirectly it greatly influences me by taking me away from an all too familiar setting, which in turn enables me to look back in from the outside. As for composers, I'd have to say that Joaquin Rodrigo, Richard Wagner, Igor Stravinsky and Eric Satie are my favorites.

   If you could pick out one album ever recorded, in which you could have been the drummer, which one would it be?

    That's a tough one. I'd have to say from a musical standpoint, it would be "Avalon" by Roxy Music, from a drum standpoint, "Joe's Garage" by Frank Zappa. But if I had to pick just one song it would be "Give Blood" by Pete Townshend, the single most incredible rock drum track ever recorded.

   What do you think are your strongest and weakest points as a player?

    I think my strong points are my ability to adapt quickly to a variety if gigs and being able to play off of someone. My weaknesses are boredom and not practicing enough.

   Thanks Jonathan!

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